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iPhone

Your thoughts please, if any.

Posted by AVP8472 on Jun 27, 2007 in Blab | 108 comments

etherbrian on Jun 27, 2007

iPhone, youPhone, all God's childrenPhone.

iconmaster on Jun 27, 2007

- Incredibly slick UI

- Plans look reasonable

- Activation looks easier than for any other phone

- Somewhat concerned about the keyboard; but then, currently I'm punching in text via a number pad

- Would really, really hate to drop it

Stratification on Jun 27, 2007

Very nice, a little out of my price range, and it's AT&T, so I'll never own one. Mostly I'm waiting for them to actually be on the market to see what people say then.

tamashii on Jun 27, 2007

I think it is safe to assume that the iPhone will be more durable than some have stated.

Psy2k on Jun 27, 2007

No support for MMS is a point that will make many people think a lot before buying it imho

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

No GSM,
Terrible Battery Life,
Battery not replaceable,
AT&T data plan way, way overpriced,
only 2 Megapixel camera, and
No Expansion slots

Apple fanatics will grab it up but few others unlike the iPod, which everybody loved.

Stratification on Jun 27, 2007

@bdelisio:
I've heard a number of people comment on good battery life, I guess we'll have to see. And AT&T is GSM, so not sure what you're getting at there. The camera and expansion slots seem to me like funny requirements for a phone, but I don't think I'm the right market anyhow. I just use my phone to make calls.

tamashii on Jun 27, 2007

But it still has SMS - which, all my geek friends use more than MMS (if not exclusively). My bosses phone doesn't have MMS. My Department Director and the CTO have MMS capable phones and neither use it.

Seems like it isn't in that much demand. Granted, the phone I have doesn't do a heck of a lot (does have texting), but I am also not likely to buy the iPhone for some time just because I just don't need another phone. I use things until they are dead. Dead-dead. So dead you have to bury it twice.

pheral on Jun 27, 2007

Hype. I hate hype. :(

Psy2k on Jun 27, 2007

@tamashi: Though not many people use MMS, thats not a reason for a high-tech phone not to support them :)

tamashii on Jun 27, 2007

@bdelisio: I've heard the "No Expansion Slot" complaint a couple of times now. Why do you need one? The things connects to your computer via a dock like and iPod and interfaces through iTunes (I think). That's more than any of the people I have talked to have ever said they needed (or asked for).

According to Walt Mossberg (WSJ) has 3 more continuous hours of battery life than is stated by Apple. That seems nice.

As for the data plan - you walk into a WiFi hotspot and you won't need to using it because you will be using the free WiFi. [Please someone correct me if I am wrong as I have gotten several conflicting statements regarding this.]

The camera? It's a phone. You're not taking Pulitzer Prize photos with it. You make calls and just happen to be able to take a snap shot or two. You want real photos - get a real camera.

@Psy2k: maybe the 2nd gen will support it. How many phones you know of are touch screen and come with a modern browser? There is a lot of stuff going on in this phone. To be honest, I just want a cell phone that sounds as good as my land line - but with companies more concerned with packing more stuff into a phone rather than making sure I can understand a caller, that will never happen.

tamashii on Jun 27, 2007

Also - you will never convince companies that the lowest common denominator of a user base is the one to build for. If MMS is not in high enough demand, it will of course be a dropped feature to make room for those that are in higher demand/need.

josh Vip-micro on Jun 27, 2007

*sigh* I'll be waiting in line across the street on Friday.

Stratification on Jun 27, 2007

Definitely looking forward to hearing your impressions Josh. My one hope is that this will make other phone manufacturers wake up and re-work their UIs.

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

@Stratification: Thank you for your insightful contribution to this thread. :) Why would you attempt to discuss the plusses/minuses of a smart phone when you're not even a smart-phone user? /*shaking head back and forth*/

How many people do you know that have this phone and claim good battery life? Hmmm...
None, I bet.

Please, in the interest of good will, don't attack someone unless you have the facts.

No matter, as a general rule of thumb, the battery life that is claimed by the manufacturer should be halved for real-world estimates. Apple claims eight for straight phone use, therefore it’s reasonable to expect four. As you say “we’ll see” but there is plenty of experience with batteries to make educated guesses. Add to the mix the touch screen and WI-FI and I can’t see how the iPhone’s battery life could be any better.

When the battery does die, and it will, you will not be able to replace it yourself. How dumb is that??? I see it as just Apple’s way to sell overpriced service plans.

The iPhone is designed to work only with AT&T's dog-slow (100 kbs, theroetical) 2G EDGE network. The iPhone does not support 3G and cannot connect the newer, speedier 3G networks such as AT&T's UMTS-HSDPA 3G.

As I said, Apple fanatics will grab it up but there are better, smarter, more reasonably priced phones for those willing to shop around.

etherbrian on Jun 27, 2007

Just thought of something: The Apple iPayPhone! I AM A GENIUS! Get Steve Jobs on the phone! Or iPhone. Or whatever.

iconmaster on Jun 27, 2007

Yeah, I do think browsing over Edge is going to be painful. But at least around here, finding a wifi hotspot isn't hard.

tamashii on Jun 27, 2007

@bdelisio: I can discuss the plus/minuses of a smart phone precisely because I do not have one. Why? Because I am still a part of the market the makers are selling to. I am an unblemished consumer in the industry. I will be the most critical on all the pros and cons of any item I currently don't own because I want to make sure I have made a good purchase should I decide to buy it.

As for battery life - I gave you a (more than) reputable source by way of a Wall Street Journal’s review of an iPhone by Walt Mossberg (y'know, because Apple has already given them out for review). The thing lasts three hours longer than what Apple claims it will. That's a fact. And I am not attacking anyone here, merely pointing out facts that I have come across.

dishg on Jun 27, 2007

iPayPhone is awesome! you can download music while you're on hold!

crunnells Vip-micro on Jun 27, 2007

My biggest hold-out right now is that you can't replace the battery. I realize that it's probably not a huge deal, and it'll probably never happen, but if it does, I don't want to have to send it in for repair.

The biggest draws, for me, are that it plays music and movies (which is available in other cheaper phones). Also, it's running OSX and Safari, so web browsing would be a snap... But honestly, the only time I'm not 10' from a computer is when I'm driving, and I don't think that's the ideal place to be web browsing.

2.0 megapixel camera? I'd rather use my Canon.

The one and only thing that is like "zomg" is the voicemail list. That is awesome.

When I first saw the announcement keynote, a part of me said "I MUST HAVE IT" but a week later I realized that I could probably spend $600 on something more fun.

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

@tamashii: You misread the WSJ article. Apple claims 8 hours of continuous talk time. Mossberg got seven hours and 18 minutes, out of the box. I expect that will go down dramatically after a few recharges. That's more than I thought but actually less than what Apple claims. And defiantly not "three hours longer than what Apple claims" (sic).

However, battery life is only one of six problems I have with this phone. Would you care to address the other five as a would-be consumer?

@crunnells: The point of buying an iPhone, in my opinion, is that you don't have to carry a Canon camera or an iPod or a PDA or anything else for that matter.

tamashii on Jun 27, 2007

@bdelisio: You're right, I latched onto this portion of the paragraph (emphasis mine)—
“And, for Web browsing and other Internet functions, including sending and receiving emails, viewing Google maps and YouTube videos, we got over nine hours, well above Apple's claim of up to six hours.”

I'm guessing I just remembered the last portion of the paragraph and not the preceding parts.

=====
Now for your other 5 questions:

(1) GSM
I so rarely leave Austin that having a cell phone with GSM seems irrelevant. I understand it might enhance the quality of voice, but I doubt it would do it to a degree to be a worthy consideration for me. For other users, this may very well be a huge contention, but unless you’re a travelin' man – is it really a necessity? Perhaps so.

(2) Battery not replaceable
Admittedly, this seems weird and awkward for a phone not to have a means to replace the battery. But after 3 years of my current cell, I have yet to need to replace the battery. Likewise, when was the last time you changed out your iPod’s battery? I have had my iPod for several years and still haven’t had to replace the battery. This doesn’t really seem like an issue.

(3) AT&T Data Plan Overpriced
Well, again, I am still confused on this specific feature/detail of cell phones. I am doing a lot of research to figure out what, exactly, it all means. Currently - I simply don't feel the need to use a phone to surf the web or send email… I just need to compile more info regarding this particular aspect of a smart phone. [Keep in mind that I am unlikely to purchase any smart phone for a year or more - regardless of make/model]

(4) 2 Megapixel Camera
I've already commented on this “issue”. It isn’t one. It’s a phone. Not a camera. The camera is a bonus and as such shouldn’t be better than the digital cameras I already use, else I would expect the iPhone to cost in the thousands. This is the weakest “complaint” about the iPhone, in my opinion.

(5) No Expansion Slots
I believe this means that it is kinda bound to AT&T right now, yes? I mean, what do you need an expansion slot on a phone for? Even a smart phone? The very fact that it can be connected to my computer and managed from my desktop or iTunes kinda makes this seem like another irrelevant complaint (to me). From what I have seen, the iPhone does a heck of a lot without an expansion slot, so I am not sure I would ever have a need for one.

rajr19 on Jun 27, 2007

i love the chinese knock off version

iconmaster on Jun 27, 2007

Sure there's no GSM?

Really, I think $60 is pretty dang reasonable for a plan that includes voice, data and text messaging.

Now if you want to argue the phone itself is expensive...

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

I forgot to include the biggest reason of all to stay away from the iPhone, if only on principle...
No. 7) AT&T spies on its customers:
AT&T Spying For The Man
AT&T willing to spy for NSA, MPAA, and RIAA
Secret Surveillance Evidence Unsealed in AT&T Spying Case

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

@iconmaster: You are correct. The iPhone has 2G built in, but not the faster 3G (3G is third-generation) technology.

2G is capable of data transmission rates of 100 kbs while 3G can go up to 2 Mbit/s. 3.5G is capable of 3 Mbit/s data rates.

In layman's terms, 2G is equivalent to dial-up (Has anyone here used dial-up lately?) while 3G is closer to DSL broadband speeds.

AVP8472 on Jun 27, 2007

A lot of great thoughts on iPhone there. I really think this is just the beginning for this type of product. Things can only get better, 2nd&3rd generation will address any problems now. Also remember its Apple, so it going to be worth the buy.

Josh, maybe after a week or so you could post up your own review on the iPhone, please!!! Its due over here in Europe in December.

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

@tamashii: Given what you said in your last post, why in the world would you spend $600 on smart phone when you don't plan to use most of the features for which you are paying.

It makes more sense for someone like you to use one of the free phones they give away with most plans. Why throw away money just to say "I own an iPhone"?

tamashii on Jun 27, 2007

@bdelisio: What part of this comment – [Keep in mind that I am unlikely to purchase any smart phone for a year or more - regardless of make/model] eludes you?

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

If Apple had marketed the iPhone as a 6G widescreen iPod with phone capabilities, I might have bought one regardless of all the problems with the other technologies.

However, 4G to 8G of memory isn't going to hold much in the way of audio and video content. That's about what the nano holds and the nano was designed just for audio content.

Currently, I have an 80G video iPod which I use all the time and I generally have around 60G of content on it at any given time.

I think if Apple morphs the iPhone into a really cool widescreen iPod with at least 80G of disk space I'ld buy it immediately to replace my current iPod. Of course, the'ld have to lower the price by about $200.

AVP8472 on Jun 27, 2007

For anyone who knows nothing about the iphone, here is a link you can check out. Plenty of video demos to watch there.

Make your own mind up about it:
iphone

heinzelman on Jun 27, 2007

@tamashii:

GSM - beyond global use, GSM also greatly enhances digital call quality for local calls. I'd personally never buy a phone without it.

Battery - You've obviously been very lucky not to have a problem with your iPod or phone battery. The reality is that batteries do go bad and when they can be easily replaced (as opposed to sending back to the factory), it's a big reliability and continuity issue.

Camera - If you're going to bother putting in a camera in a phone in summer 2007, make it state of the art and not 2006 technology. The major value prop from apple is that this phone is different, in reality it isn't, in fact in many cases its sub-standard. I agree that it shouldn’t be better that SLRs but for 6 bones I’d better get state of the art.

Same argument for expansion slots. I'll add that this is really the manifestation of Apple's "our way or no way" mentality. They don't want any chance of interoperability messing with their products and possible cutting into their coolness or profitability potential. 8 GB is a lot of memory but sometimes we can’t get enough of it as you won’t be deleting "Lost" to accommodate some new movie this is when a Memory card comes in the picture.

Just my 2 cents

tamashii on Jun 27, 2007

@heinzelman:

As iconmaster already pointed out, the iPhone, does in fact have GSM (albeit 2G). I think this is also a limitation of AT&T, not Apple. I also don’t see 2G being so ancient as to have a significant impact on voice clarity. I could be wrong, of course, as my phone is older than 3G tech.

I decided to call a couple of friends outside my family of electronic users regarding battery life of their phones and iPods and such. I am never so lucky as to not have a problem. Everyone I contacted has the same experience I do. Clearly, it has nothing to do with luck at all. This is not to say that batteries never go bad, but I think it happens far less often than all the anti-iPhone people are making out. Out of my current stock of 3 iPods, 4 cell phones (bought at the same time for family members when I moved to a new plan) and a PowerBook: not one replaced battery needed so far. Additionally, the cell phone I had for almost 5 years prior to my current model never needed a battery replacement. Perhaps I am lucky, but I am going to say I am not.

With regard to the camera - is it really that sub-standard for a phone? I don't know. I know there are phones with video capture capability, but that seems like a lot of software and hardware that might not lend itself to the sleekness of the iPhone right now. Just about any phone you can buy today is going to come with a camera on it - smart or otherwise. I would still not use it unless I ran across Big Foot. I understand your point, however, that any cutting edge device should not be using old tech, but is one year really that old? Technology moves so quickly these days that any product could be considered old before it is even released.

As for expansion slots, I still don’t see the significance you (and many others) have with the lack of this feature. If you have “Lost” on your iPhone, then you have it in your iTunes. Deleting any movie/tv episode from your iPhone will be as common as updating your iPod Shuffle with a fresh set of tunes. I think any company should have the right to make sure their products aren’t watered down with crap. It’s worked for Apple rather well all these years. Why mess with that?

AVP8472 on Jun 27, 2007

Iconmaster, nice little video on the iPhone keyboard here:

iPhone keyboard

gswd on Jun 27, 2007

I will start off by saying that I used to sell cell phones at Radio Shack. It was always recommended that the battery be replaced every 12 months. However, most people did not replace the battery, they just got a new phone with the 1 year contract. And, more than likely, the battery on the iPhone will be replaceable at a major AT&T store that has a service department, or at an Apple store. Or at least I would suspect it could be, instead of having to send it out to the factory.

My brother is planning on getting one, mostly because it is the "new thing" but also because he hates his Razor.

The one thing I have not seen mentioned here is that it will not work with Exchange Server for email, so most "road warriors" won't be able to use it as their sole business tool. (or so I have heard)

One of the things talked about when first announced was "other than Apple software, what can this stripped down OSX run?" I have since read that they do have support for "widget like" programs.

I have a smartphone (Cingular 2125) running Windows Mobile. Have had it for about a year. Mostly happy with it, but it does have it's issues. What do I use it for? Phone calls, the occasional text message (when American Idol is not on), an occasional picture when I am driving down the road and need to remember a phone number from a sign, but that is about it. I have not installed a bunch of little apps, tho some sound pretty cool.

It does have a mini-SD card, so I was able to load up a bunch of songs - since it is a Napster-to-Go certified device, but I can honestly say that I have not listened to that music. But I also don't listen to the songs on my iPod or other MP3 player.

I don't know if the Google Maps feature will work like an in-car navigation system (ie GPS), but if it does, that would be cool.

Anyway, those are my thoughts/ramblings. I will be interested to hear what the people who are the early adopters have to say about it, and especially if it will run the IB widget.

iconmaster on Jun 27, 2007

The one thing I have not seen mentioned here is that it will not work with Exchange Server for email

There's an interesting rumor about that.

If I had to guess, I'd wager that there'll be some very basic Exchange support such as Apple has built into Mail on the Macs.

rajr19 on Jun 27, 2007

actually, the wall street journal said that the battery life was awesome.

rajr19 on Jun 27, 2007

read what i said, bat. life = good

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

@tamashii:
As I posted above, AT&T does offer a 3G service. It is called UMTS-HSDPA 3G

Apple claims its batteries to last about 400 full charge and discharge cycles. This equivocates to a little over 2 years of battery life if the user fully charges and discharges the battery every other day, on average.

This is why the Apple AppleCare Protection Plan service covers only the first two years of ownership. Apple doesn’t want to replace the batteries as part of its Protection Plan.

As for the camera, I think heinzelman hit the nail on the head in his previous post. What's the point in owning an iPhone, one of the most expensive phones money can buy, if it's not the best in everything it does.

Expansion slots are not only for additional memory but can also hold applications, games and so much more. I disagree with heinzelman that "8 GB is a lot of memory". Most commercial DVD's are about 8G per movie. Not much room for anything else there. How is the iPhone supposed to sync with my 60G iTunes library? /* Holy Crap! I used two i-words in the same sentence.*/ I think the addition of a hard drive model is somewhere down the pike. Apple just needs to work out the battery issues first.

In summary, my biggest gripes with the iPhone are:

1. Not 3G enabled
2. Terrible Battery Life
3. Battery not replaceable
4. Only 2 Megapixel camera
5. No Expansion slots
6. AT&T data plan 50% to 100% more expensive over comparable plans by T-Mobile, others.
7. AT&T spies on its customers
8. It's not an iPod

If Apple would just take the iPhone screen, put it on an 80G iPod and offer it for about $400 I’d be delighted. ... I'd even stand in line to buy one. :)

rajr19 on Jun 27, 2007

what is up with the reposting

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

@ rajr19: the WSJ article you cite was brought up and discussed 35 posts ago. What's your point? Is "awesome" a direct quote?

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

Gripe number 9 (non-technical, I admit):
Apple replaced the original hand model for the iPhone with a hand model whose hands were huge in comparison, in order to make the phone look smaller in the ads.

AVP8472 on Jun 27, 2007

"I don't know if the Google Maps feature will work like an in-car navigation system (ie GPS), but if it does, that would be cool."

It has a start and end destination feature and will map you entire route through Google Maps.

rajr19 on Jun 27, 2007

i believe that is false, but you probably know more than i do.

AVP8472 on Jun 27, 2007

It's really true, check out the first link I posted above called 'iPhone'. The video demo shows it working.

bdelisio on Jun 27, 2007

Since AT&T is willing to spy for the NSA, MPAA, and RIAA, with the launch of the iPhone, image what AT&T will do with all the data they collect from all the iTunes accounts that will be connected to their network through the iPhone. Hmmm... Who will the suit-happy guardians of copyrighted material go after first?

BTW I've just been browsing the Latest issue of ComputerWorld magazine. Check out the iPhone related articles:
Opinion: Why iPhone is wrong, wrong, wrong
How to snare the elusive iPhone
Gartner urges IT to embrace consumer devices but resist iPhone
Apple touts iPhone keyboard as first reviews hit
IT Braces for iPhone Debut

JBVisions on Jun 28, 2007

@ Tamashii But after 3 years of my current cell, I have yet to need to replace the battery.Whaaat!? I have 3 phones in the drawer all with dead batteries and it costs more to get a new battery than a new phone.

If the batteries lasted longer I wouldn't change as it's such a hassle. I recently acquired a Blackberry and it's driving me nuts already. Constantly having to recharge the darn thing.

Spongefile on Jun 28, 2007

It's a good start, but I've gotten addicted to the camera quality of my Nokia N73, not to mention other more advanced mobile features and apps I won't be able to load into the iPhone... I'll be more interested in iPhone version 2, when they get the technology up to date, and maybe open up the OS to developers.

Spongefile on Jun 28, 2007

Re: 3G. I've turned 3G off on my phone, it's only good for MMS and often won't let calls through(!!) so I'm not too worried about the iPhone not having it.

iconmaster on Jun 28, 2007

bdeliso: the AT&T "spying" issue is pretty clearly related to what people do on their AT&T broadband connections, not cell phone networks. It's impractical and consumer-unfriendly, but basing your case against the iPhone on that issue is a pretty big stretch.

Why do you seem to have such a chip on your shoulder about the device, if I may ask?

tamashii on Jun 28, 2007

@JB: yup - have never had to replace a battery on any cell phone I have ever owned. I honestly didn’t know battery life was such an issue.

bdelisio on Jun 28, 2007

@iconmaster: the iPhone is intended to be primarily an internet device: email, IM, web, music, video, TV, movies etc. The phone functionality is essentially a throw-in. You need only look at Apple's own ads, which spend >90% of the time promoting internet interoperability, to realize that. Therefore, to pretend that the spying policy of AT&T is not a concern to users of the iPhone in particular, and to US citizens in general, is an oversight in my opinion.

And what is forcing AT&T to draw a line at its internet infrastructure? They can just as easily monitor voice traffic. I believe the only reason stopping AT&T from spying on voice calls is that it is illegal. So should surveillance of Internet traffic. When organizations like the Electronic Frontier Foundation file a class-action suit, accusing AT&T of "illegally assisting in the NSA's spying on millions of ordinary Americans" I listen. And if more people don't get involved and fight this kind of policy, our rights as consumers and citizens will be diminished.

I do not have a chip on my shoulder at all and I don't appreciate the insinuation that my arguments are with out merit. I think I have supplied sufficient documentation for every point I raised in this discussion. On the contrary, all I've heard in rebuttal is that "I like this" or I don't need that" or "My rights as a consumer and citizen of the United States are secondary to the mesiah Steve Jobs efforts to put this device in my hands". What a load... :) ooops!

iconmaster on Jun 28, 2007

Without merit? No. But let's just say you're probably fighting a losing battle.

AVP8472 on Jun 28, 2007

Have to agree with Iconmaster, it does come across like you have a chip on your shoulder about Apple/iPhone and your last comment about Steve Jobs there might just confirm it. You do however make you points well and in great detail, but as you are entitled to your opinion as are the rest of us. ;)

bdelisio on Jun 28, 2007

@AVP8472: the last line was a joke. The first part was the setup, the second the punchline.

I have nothing against Apple at all. As I said many times before I love the iPods, particularly the 5G video version. And I never had a problem with any of them except to replace the earbuds from time to time. I believe we own 6 or 7 of them, 3 video and 3-4 others. Never even changed a battery, nothing.

AVP8472 on Jun 28, 2007

Anyway it comes out tomorrow, so there will be plenty of everyday user reviews up on the web over the next few days.

tamashii on Jun 28, 2007

Never even changed a battery, nothing.

Ima just bask in that for a bit…

AVP8472 on Jun 28, 2007

the last line was a joke

That's cool man, my bad!!

bdelisio on Jun 28, 2007

that was for you tamashii :)

Stratification on Jun 28, 2007

I'm still going to wait for reports from normal users (aside from reviewers) since the vast majority of what is flying around the web seems to be FUD.

bdelisio on Jun 28, 2007

@AVP8472; That's cool, it was very subtle.

bdelisio on Jun 28, 2007

@iconmaster: this is all your fault, you know. Yep.

If I had some tokens or stamps in my account I wouldn't be prowling around the blogs looking for something to do! :)

JBVisions on Jun 28, 2007

Starts taking bets on set 100 being iPhone related :)

gswd on Jun 28, 2007

@Stratification - which definition would you prefer we use? I like the "Scottish colloquialism for a rabbit's tail" myself, but don't think that it applies in this instance.

tamashii on Jun 28, 2007

Cupertino Collect Call is already an iPhone-related set. I have a feeling that the 100th set will not be iPhone related.

Classicsmiley on Jun 28, 2007

$500 for a phone? If I had that kind of money, I'd be buying this.

AVP8472 on Jun 29, 2007

:)

MaskedJedi on Jun 29, 2007

The iPhone's obsolete. That's a fact. In fact, it's been publicly obsolete ever since Jobs first announced its existence. After that press conference, there was a CNN story about how they wern't getting worked up over the iPhone in Japan because their phones do more. Way to stay on the cutting edge, Apple.

And |-|4><0r, 73|-| l33t 1, g0d 0f
g4/\/\3z0rz, saw Microsof, and it was l33t. Then he looked upon Apple, and was destroyed by d4 n00bn3ss and 73|-| 3vil.

JBVisions on Jun 29, 2007

Can somebody please translate that last bit.

ubergeek2 on Jun 29, 2007

Reinvent the phone? uh, this has all been done already.

zelda013 on Jun 29, 2007

@ JB : "And Haxor, the leet (ndlr: degenerative form of "elite") one, god of gamers, saw Microsoft, and it was leet. Then he looked upon Apple and was destroyed by the noobness and the evil."

zelda013 on Jun 29, 2007

(just lean back and squint a little.)

AVP8472 on Jun 29, 2007

I've been squinting for 2 hours now and nothing :) :)

iconmaster on Jun 29, 2007

Chef Josh is even now in line at the Southlake Apple Store here. The line is already substantial, with nine hours to go until the iPhone goes on sale.

Fortunately it's not raining... yet.

ClassicSmiley -- that lego model is incredible.

JBVisions on Jun 29, 2007

9 hours!!!! Have you had him tested recently?

JBVisions on Jun 29, 2007

@Zelda

I've leaned, squinted, squinted in somebody else's glasses and I still can't see how d4 ends up as the. Don't they teach kids to write in schools these days.

(Oh no, nix that, there was an article in the news recently about New Zealand allowing text speak to be written in exams.)

tamashii on Jun 29, 2007

d4 = da = tha = the

JBVisions on Jun 29, 2007

Yes of course it does. :∫

zelda013 on Jun 29, 2007

see now i think leet speak is creative and funny (but then i love language in all its forms including slang, argot, dialect and engrish), but i think allowing text speak on school exams is a travesty. you should know the rules before you break them (see : picasso's drawing skills). sometimes i worry that the population in general is becoming progressively less eloquent and articulate, which would be tragic.

bonus points for whoever can find that statistic about the size of shakespeare's vocabulary, compared to the average vocabulary in the 21st century.

maybe tamashii's diagram will make more sense to you written like this :
d4 = dA = thA = the
(the idea of leet is to replace actual letters with other characters that resemble them).

hmm. sorry for the extreme off-topicness, i didn't mean to hijack this thread... um, iPhone ! yeah ! you can write stuff on that too i hear !

zelda013 on Jun 29, 2007

and now back to our regularly scheduled topic : 9 hours on line for a phone (admittedly a stylie one, but still) ??? seriously ???

gswd on Jun 29, 2007

I could get the "d4" -> the, but I guess even in 1337-speak, dyslexia is a problem:

73|-| = the ?

maybe 7|-|3 = the

MaskedJedi on Jun 29, 2007

73|-| is correct. It's not dyslexia.

gswd on Jun 29, 2007

My brother, who I have said is planning to get one, was going to go to the store later, since they had told him that they were going to close at 4:30 then open back up at 6 for the iPhone. He did not want to take the day off from work. Of course the AT&T store didn't really indicate to him that no phone was going to be available until 6, they were just doing it to be fair, since they did not know when their shipment would be delivered.

I've still got a year on my contract. So I get to see about the "real world" usefulness, and what other come up with to compete.

gswd on Jun 29, 2007

@MaskedJedi

but wouldn't that be "teh"?

zelda013 on Jun 29, 2007

because when you type fast you make a lot of typso d00d

zelda013 on Jun 29, 2007

that's where pwned came from too. (p next to o on keyboard)

gswd on Jun 29, 2007

*insert crazy old guy look*

zelda013 on Jun 29, 2007

hee...

JBVisions on Jun 29, 2007

that's where pwned came from too Ahh that answers another question. Couldn't work out why everyone was pawning stuff.

gswd, think you and I should retire to a quite corner somewhere and read Shakespeare

iconmaster on Jun 29, 2007

Lady Macbeth: PWNED!

zelda013 on Jun 29, 2007

pwned, forsooth !

tamashii on Jun 29, 2007

2b or ≠2b

socrates on Jun 29, 2007

tamashii... HAH!!!

Stratification on Jun 29, 2007

Or alternatively:
2b || !2b

socrates on Jun 29, 2007

dang beat me to it ;)

JBVisions on Jun 29, 2007

Eye of newt, and toe of frog
Dost not me help to read this blog

gswd on Jun 29, 2007

O, call back yesterday, bid time return!
King Richard II. Act iii. Sc. 2

gswd on Jun 29, 2007

2 1/2 hours, and no word on my brother. But then again, I might not hear anything from him for awhile.

bdelisio on Jul 01, 2007

The NY Times' David Pogue on The iPhone Challenge: Keep It Quiet

bdelisio on Jul 01, 2007

Question: Do you have to get the AT&T Edge data service with the iPhone or could you just use available wi-fi?

Seems to me that with free wi-fi available in many areas and almost everywhere in a big city, why buy a crappy data service?

Q2: How do you switch between the built-in 2G and wi-fi?

whoisgregg on Jul 02, 2007

I have an iPhone. :)

You connect to available wifi easily:

Settings > Wifi > Click a network from the list

The first time it finds a new network it will also ask, "Do you want to join SsidHere?" and you can have it prompt for every connection.

Overall, it's a great device. iChat-esque SMS, Visual Voicemail, and the best cellphone camera I've ever had (beats my RAZR, SLVR, and cheapies) makes this thing a joy to use.

I've always been mildly offended by the poor quality cellphone software that has been foisted on me in the past. This is the first phone that takes usability seriously.

The Edge network makes most websites somewhat usable. Although it takes forever for gmail to initially load (via Safari, not the built-in POP mail support) but after that it feels almost as quick as a normal connection.

Of course, it doesn't have expansion slots, an 80 GB hard drive, or one of those Mr. Fusion power cells (still not sure what does come with those, but clearly some people's expectations make it clear they've found an infinite battery supply device), but it still blows away everything else I've seen, used, and owned.

robopopo on Jul 04, 2007

want it....badly! for me one of the sexiest piece of tech. meow!

AVP8472 on Jul 04, 2007

@ robopopo: The iPhone is out in Europe around December, so start dropping hints for an Xmas present now.

bdelisio on Sep 05, 2007

Now this is what I'm talking about, the new iPod touch

Thanks for listening, Steve.

jmnovak on Sep 05, 2007

If the Touch had more storage, I would be *severely* tempted; but maxing out at 16GB, I'm only somewhat tempted...

a2 on Sep 05, 2007

Yeah, storage is something I think about now. Who knew 15GB of music would be so small? Besides, I just upgraded to a new 30GB iPod, so I'll wait until I max that one out before looking for something new.....

zelda013 on Sep 05, 2007

hou mama !!! it's the future !!!

i want that one ! even if i do spend most of my time at home.

in case you were wondering what to get me for my birthday...